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"tablet discussion", 31st Dec 2018, 3:09 AM #1
keltyzoid!
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i swear to god if anyone comes in here saying "i draw traditionally and have no opinion lol" i'll punch you in the neck

recently got my first Big Boy tablet (XP Pen Artist 12) with a fancy screen you can draw on and it's really nice. i bought my boyfriend the XP Pen Artist 13.3 or whatever the fuck it's called and now neither of us are using our Wacom/Bamboo tablets. now, i've been watching reviews of tablets for a while, and i watched one that compared the 200-something dollar Artist 12 to the Cintiq 13 HD, and it made me wonder why anyone buys Cintiq or Wacom tablet, because a 200 Dollar tablet from china had better specs than the 800 dollar name brand tablet everyone loses their minds over.

do people only buy Cintiq tablets because they want to flex on people with a name brand now that there's a load of competitors with better tech and lower prices? do people think that owning an 800 dollar tablet means they're a professional artist?

also i recommend getting an XP Pen tablet with a screen, since they're cheap and your whole life will change when you realize how much easier it is to draw directly on the screen.
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31st Dec 2018, 3:49 AM #2
Eli Cosmanis

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I'd imagine a combination of
warranty - brand recognition - support
I follow youtube reviews of such devices and it seems the drivers and program compatibility, while decent, can still falter a bit compared to the wacom solutions. On a mac you might be better off with wacom or if you commonly draw in photoshop you might be better off with wacom, for example.
31st Dec 2018, 4:16 AM #3
Seabiscuit
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I think a big part of it is probably that wacom basically had a huge monopoly on the whole 'screen tablet' market for sooooo many years, partly cause of some patent or something
For a while a lot of the other screen tablets on the market, while cheaper, were pretty iffy in quality

This whole thing with screen tablets being a price that isn't batshit insane and also being pretty damn good quality is still kinda new, I think

It'll be a while yet before people realize that wacom is no longer the only viable option
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31st Dec 2018, 4:27 AM #4
mightguy15

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keltyzoid!:
do people only buy Cintiq tablets because they want to flex on people with a name brand now that there's a load of competitors with better tech and lower prices? do people think that owning an 800 dollar tablet means they're a professional artist?


I see people make this case all the time, and my answer is always the same. Draw with what you can invest in.

I own a Cintiq, and from my experience, the people who think its just 800 dollar bragging rights are typically people who have never used one. I did not buy a Cintiq because I think Im richer than anyone else and I have never seen people with Cintiqs make this point. I bought a Cintiq because it is a product from a trusted brand I have supported for many years, and the driver support Wacom typically outperforms drivers from shady Chinese companies.

Before XP Pen, Chinese companies were the only ones offering competition for Wacom. The Huion Tablets are inexpensive as well, however, I do not typically trust Chinese companies, the biggest reasons thier products are so cheap is because they are typically assembled in sweat shops where people get paid criminally low wages and work in horrible conditions. Also, Huion tablets are faulty with shaky driver support sites ( I hear they got better now though). Wacom (a japanese company) gets parts from china, but assembles thier products elsewhere. Of course they are gonna be more expensive. Also, when I purchased my Cintiq, I was not aware of the XP-Pen, and I might have bought into it to be honest. I was in the army at the time, and I had the money to essentially do whatever I want.

But this post has gone on long enough. The point being, graphics tablets are a moderately new market. No one anticipated the arrival of a cheaper tablet that outperfoms because since the 90s, Wacom was a leader in the industry. And your kidding yourself if you can convice yourself they arent good.
31st Dec 2018, 4:44 AM #5
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Wacoms were the only reliable tablet I knew of (I had a bamboo when I was in middle school I adored) and I had gotten burned by the cheaper alternatives I tried. In particular, I have a hell of a bone to pick with Huion and their fragile ass pens. I should not be spending more on pens than I am on the tablet. I broke two in the same week - one broke for seemingly no reason after 3 months, and the other one I dropped. Once.

So, I defaulted back to Wacom because I trusted them, and they certainly get the job done... even if I did shell out more than I would've liked. (It's worth noting I don't have a Cintiq. I have an Intuos.)

That said I've never even heard of XP Pen. Now I need to check them out. I probably won't bother upgrading until something happens to my Intuos because boy oh boy do I not have money, but thanks for the alternative to check out! A reliable screen tablet that costs less than my Intuos did sounds like a dream.
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31st Dec 2018, 5:17 AM #6
deo101
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I have a cintiq, and I have had it for about 3 or 4 years now. I decided to get it because my old tablet was a bamboo one, I used it nearly every day, and it still works perfectly after using it for 5 years. my mom and sister still both use my old tablet. my cintiq also still works perfectly and I haven't had a single problem with it (other than my brother breaking the screen once a few years ago)

I wanted to upgrade to one with a screen for a while, we used cintiq tablets at my school, and wacom is a brand I and industry professionals trust. I don't want to be testing out other technology that might end up messing me up. I know wacom will work for me, so I decided to continue with them. Peace of mind that I have a tablet that will work for as long as I want to keep using it is worth the "extra money". I have used this tablet for thousands of hours, I think an $800 investment is worth it.
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31st Dec 2018, 5:21 AM #7
keltyzoid!
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mightguy15:I see people make this case all the time, and my answer is always the same. Draw with what you can invest in.

I own a Cintiq, and from my experience, the people who think its just 800 dollar bragging rights are typically people who have never used one. I did not buy a Cintiq because I think Im richer than anyone else and I have never seen people with Cintiqs make this point. I bought a Cintiq because it is a product from a trusted brand I have supported for many years, and the driver support Wacom typically outperforms drivers from shady Chinese companies.

Before XP Pen, Chinese companies were the only ones offering competition for Wacom. The Huion Tablets are inexpensive as well, however, I do not typically trust Chinese companies, the biggest reasons thier products are so cheap is because they are typically assembled in sweat shops where people get paid criminally low wages and work in horrible conditions. Also, Huion tablets are faulty with shaky driver support sites ( I hear they got better now though). Wacom (a japanese company) gets parts from china, but assembles thier products elsewhere. Of course they are gonna be more expensive. Also, when I purchased my Cintiq, I was not aware of the XP-Pen, and I might have bought into it to be honest. I was in the army at the time, and I had the money to essentially do whatever I want.

But this post has gone on long enough. The point being, graphics tablets are a moderately new market. No one anticipated the arrival of a cheaper tablet that outperfoms because since the 90s, Wacom was a leader in the industry. And your kidding yourself if you can convice yourself they arent good.


no need to get defensive when i never said they were bad, just wondered why people spend that kind of cash when there's an alternative. most artists don't have 800 dollars lying around to just toss into the ether.

Huion isn't what i was suggesting, though. their screen quality is poor and don't have accurate color, and apparently their pens break on the regular, according to Nyomi.
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31st Dec 2018, 5:25 AM #8
Vincethestick
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Honestly, if you're using a screen tablet and have zero issues, why would the thought of going back to a bamboo ever cross your minds?

As far as Wacom goes, they do have brand recognition but they're stuff also just works. The drivers work great, the pen doesn't need batteries - which they had a vice grip on for a while until now - so at the time it was one of the better convenience options. It also didn't have that annoying lag and trailing cursor issue cheaper brands had. The screens on the cintiqs have a nice non-slippery texture (though I put a textured protector on mine cause I'm paranoid with screens). They certainly don't feel cheap either, in fact I've taken mine apart to add ram and replace the wifi card on separate occasions and everything from the inside to the outside snaps together and holds tight.

The 13HD is pretty old but it still has comparative specs to today's standards. For better or for worse, they really were the best option when screen tablets were just being a thing.

Granted, I bought a Companion 2 used on eBay cause I do think that the huge gap between brands is pretty bunk. The monopoly side of things I don't like, and while I don't think they're gonna budge on prices, alternative options are growing. So do whatever, I guess. Just get a screen tablet within your means. I bought my cintiq with paypal credit.
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31st Dec 2018, 5:32 AM #9
mightguy15

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keltyzoid!:no need to get defensive when i never said they were bad, just wondered why people spend that kind of cash when there's an alternative. most artists don't have 800 dollars lying around to just toss into the ether.

Huion isn't what i was suggesting, though. their screen quality is poor and don't have accurate color, and apparently their pens break on the regular, according to Nyomi.


I was afraid of sounding defensive, I apologise, I was simply offering a diffrent perspective.

XP-Pen have only been around since 2005 and the product you are discribing came out last year.

I should have cut to the chase from the start, sorry for ranting on. In fact I should be thanking you. You taught me something new, I never heard of this brand, and after some quick research, I actually agree with you. I have never seen a quality graphics tablet for 200 dollars ever, that is a deal!

Seems Wacom better get thier ish together, the future is gonna be pretty grim for them if they release sub standard tablets at more than triple the price. Artist 12 specs outperform on every level
31st Dec 2018, 5:34 AM #10
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In my case, I have a cintiq and mirror Deo101's exact sentiments.

I've used the 12wx (reliable as hell, but clunky and inconvenient to use due to the old power box and 9 million cables, but it's a tank) and had that since... 2008. 10 years later, that fucker has never failed on me when I've needed it.

I use a ctiniq 13hd now, and I'm on my second one. My previous 13hd only died last year because my DISGUSTING FAT TITS knocked over a mug of boiling hot tea onto the tablet, frying it. Otherwise, I'd been using that tablet for about 4-5 years with no hiccups and the portability of it was wonderful.

Since I've been using cintiqs and wacom since 2008 (previously I had used standard tablets from other companies and had several die on me), I trust the brand much more because of my experiences with both tablets.

For me, I use my cintiq every single day (unless windows 10 is giving me it's regular bullshit), not just as a tablet but also as a second monitor, so it's very, very convenient and useful for me (I also use it as a placemat and eat my dinner and practically live at my desk LOL it's pretty hardy so long as put something between it and my dishes), and it fits perfectly into the small sliver of desk space I have.

When I was in art school, my cintiq was very convenient for me to simply unplug (but leave the cables at my desk), put in my backpack and walk home with, then plug into another set of cables at my apartment, or simply just use my cintiq 12wx.
For me, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. I'll consider a display tablet that isn't wacom if and when I need it now that the market has more options. But as things stand, I don't think I'll need a new tablet for another 6-10 years so long as I don't fry my current tablet.
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31st Dec 2018, 5:38 AM #11
keltyzoid!
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deo101:I have a cintiq, and I have had it for about 3 or 4 years now. I decided to get it because my old tablet was a bamboo one, I used it nearly every day, and it still works perfectly after using it for 5 years. my mom and sister still both use my old tablet. my cintiq also still works perfectly and I haven't had a single problem with it (other than my brother breaking the screen once a few years ago)

I wanted to upgrade to one with a screen for a while, we used cintiq tablets at my school, and wacom is a brand I and industry professionals trust. I don't want to be testing out other technology that might end up messing me up. I know wacom will work for me, so I decided to continue with them. Peace of mind that I have a tablet that will work for as long as I want to keep using it is worth the "extra money". I have used this tablet for thousands of hours, I think an $800 investment is worth it.


i dig. with the amount of shit you're gonna be doing, may as well trust what you're doing it on, especially in your case since your stuff's on point.

@Vince is a companion 2 its own separate device?
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31st Dec 2018, 5:43 AM #12
JackFractal

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I have a 13HD, and I bought it when it was new. I've used it daily for almost six years and I haven't had any trouble with it.

When I bought it, there were no comparable tablet monitors on the market. If I were going to buy another one, I'd consider an XP-Pen, because they are way cheaper, but I'll probably only do that when my Cintiq stops working, and THAT will probably only happen if I do something like Shekets did.

Wacom are jerks because, for a long time, they held a patent monopoly on a lot of core technology necessary to make good tablets. I buy from them because their products are high quality, and they last forever.
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31st Dec 2018, 5:47 AM #13
keltyzoid!
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the Doc Martens of tablets, it seems.
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31st Dec 2018, 5:50 AM #14
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The Companion 2 is an independent 13HD with its own OS, basically a tablet with Wacom tech in it. I bought it for convenience cause at the time I only had a shitty laptop. Now that I have a real PC I use the Companion in 'monitor mode', which is just a fancy term for using it as a monitor, but I can still use it for drawing.

I put it through hell before that point though, running things it probably has no business running, so I trust the stability of these things.
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31st Dec 2018, 6:11 AM #15
mightguy15

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dude, those things have an i7 core, they can run gta5 with minimal lag....

I never really considered the companion 2 because it seems like overkill for just wanting to draw some pictures, lol.

last I checked, those things were over 2grand, are they still expensive? and jsut out of curiosity, would you recommend them over Cintiqs for thier mobility (the reason Im considering buying one)
31st Dec 2018, 6:18 AM #16
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I also have a 13HD, though I didn't spend any money on it and got it through trading a bamboo create with a classmate. She was using her Cintiq like it was a Bamboo/Intuos with the screen off since she preferred that, and I felt kind of like I was getting away with murder lol because that Create was a secondhand one I'd bought off Ebay for $60 when my first one broke.

In defense of that first Create, I'd already had it for five or six years and it only stopped working because it got stepped on by a woman in heels.

I can definitely agree to the general quality level of Wacom, even if some specifics of the Cintiq 13HD's design are baffling. I find the stand it comes with to be functional but a little annoying, and the way that the cord attaches to the side of it with no protection or support in the event of someone knocking into it is just stupid. Despite these complaints I don't consider the quality to be bad. Overall, I've had mine for two years and its previous owner had it for about another two so it's lasted well so far.

When it inevitably breaks I'll probably have to look into alternatives or crowdfund for a new one because I've never been able to afford a $700 computer, let alone a tablet. All I can do is hope that the competition that Wacom is finally seeing will lead to them lowering prices, because I also can't afford to shell out money on brands I don't know if I can trust and then not be able to get it back.
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31st Dec 2018, 6:35 AM #17
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The main issue is less of the processor and more of the graphics card, which is not really suited for high spec gaming. I ran Overwatch, Dying Light, GTA V, and a bunch of others but they had to be mid-to-low settings to run as a reasonable fps. Also running things like sketchup and blender was less intensive but still made the fans throw a fit from time to time.

I bought mine a few years ago and it was still circulating between 1500-1800 (if you aren't getting it from Wacom themselves which is still around 2 grand) so I'd wager they're around the same if not slightly lower by now. I'd only recommend them if you really care about mobility or like to move around a lot. Personally not having to hook it to another thing was pretty nice, not gonna lie. But if you are mostly at home, and mostly draw at home, and have a decent pc or something, I'd just stick with a 13HD or whatever if you already have one.

Overall though, it wouldn't be a bad choice to have the best of both worlds cause it can also still be used as a regular cintiq, if need be.
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31st Dec 2018, 6:38 AM #18
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The screen resolution is a big priority for me. I got a Cintiq Pro because it was the only one that goes up to 4k that I've found. If my only options had been 1080p, I would've just stayed on my 9 year old Intuos that still works perfectly.
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31st Dec 2018, 7:18 AM #19
SarahSophia
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Well... someone is getting a XP pen 13.3v2 for christmas...
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31st Dec 2018, 8:18 AM #20
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keltyzoid!:also i recommend getting an XP Pen tablet with a screen, since they're cheap and your whole life will change when you realize how much easier it is to draw directly on the screen.


Hey, how sturdy/portable would you say that XP Pen tablet is? I used to take my shitty little Bamboo pad out to coffee shops, but I've been rocking a Cintiq since the end of 2014 and I wouldn't risk lugging it around - 'cause I bought it and then, I never had money again; the end. ...Haha naww, that's not quite true. XD But I've had a burning desire for a portable-but-still-pretty-good "beater tablet" for a long, long time.

To answer your question tho' I chose Cintiq back then, because I just plain hadn't heard of anything else. Except for maybe Huion, but Cintiq had much better reviews. My big debate at the time wasn't the brand, but a choice between the 22HD and the Companion for the above reasons. Longevity was my main concern, since I was willing to spend, but unsure if I'd be able to afford a replacement if the device kicked the bucket too quickly, or if I invested in a bad choice. On that note, the Cintiq brand comes with a certain sense of security.

Maybe in offices/professional circles/studios, there's a status thing involved. Don't know; don't care. But now that I've been around the block a few times and I know what I need, I'm open to considering other brands. My Cintiq isn't perfect - it does this wonky line thing toward the borders of the screen. It's a minor annoyance; I just keep away from the edges and work from the center. In spite of this, I love the damn thing.

I just miss working outside of my house!
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